Yeah, because most people use headphones for portability, where audio quality is not a priority. Why use headphones at home? They'll never sound as good as a hi-fi speaker system. I've tried.

It's not gonna be surprising at all considering the general market's gonna be looking for convenience first and foremost. There's a lot of benefits to both wireless and wired however, and while the generic supermarket earbuds might be replaced entirely the specialist audio spaces will keep holding on. IMO we're in a renaissance of cheap, quality audio for both sides of the coin, and I don't see a way that wired will become completely extinct, as long as audio companies have a say in the matter, as well as tech companies in general, as quality, wired audio transitions from a standard to a desirable feature that's just another to add to the marketing of phones/smart devices.

It’s the other way around for me. I want the music directly between my ears, also there’s the convenience of seamlessly going from listening to music to talking with friends without switching the audio device.

I’ve tried fancy studio monitors but returned them again because I just didn’t use them very often. Maybe I need to try again some time.

>they're BETTER for the average consumer than any wired IEMs, period.

damn its like the people here care about audio and are not the average consumer

How in the world do you think this opinion is unpopular?

The popularity, convenience or (eventual) quality of wireless audio is not the thing in question. It's a sugar coated poison pill, a false choice. Same as trojan horsing non user replaceable batteries via water resistance in phones or removing headphone jacks from devices to create and grow the TWS market. It's not an either/or.

it's a matter of preference, I also have an studio/monitor pair of headphones and don't use them too much nowadays, I mostly use them when I watch movies/play games, or when I'm so high that I actually want to listen and enjoy to my music with my whole attention. everything else, I go with wireless...

I argue the other way around, I think hifi speaker systems are good and all that, but i still prefer headphones because I feel as I can listen to way more detail and isolate myself from outside noises. also you need to invest big bucks in hifi speakers if you want to match the detail of headphones 🤷

there's a fair share of people here or other forums that are in absolute denial, and refuse to believe that wired headphones/IEMs are beign replaced and soon be "outdated" tech.

this has happened a lot of times in different markets.

remember when people were saying that notebook/laptops weren't going to replace stationary computers at the home-use market? well they did

remember when. people were saying that smartphones weren't going to replace "dumb" feature phones or computers for the average consumer? well they did

it's has happened over and over and over, and now it will happen to headphones too, just watch how soon wired becomes a thing of the past.

DAMMMnnnn!!!

Oddly most TWS users I know are actually using them to block out the daily sounds of city living or their job site’s noise.

The only thing that really annoys me about most wireless audio implementations is that their latency basically makes playing rhythm games impossible. Even playing other games, the latency tends to drive me a bit crazy.

> Why use headphones at home? They'll never sound as good as a hi-fi speaker system. I've tried.

Disagree with your subjective impression but in no way is it "wrong" nor do I mean to imply it is. Just speaking from my own preferences.

Obviously, headphones won't deliver the chest feel of a stereo system nor will they deliver a soundstage on the level of stereo. But on pure sound quality, my headphones eek out my 2.1 system. Both cost roughly the same (LCD-5 vs. Philharmonic BMR towers) and both employ DSP (convolution to measure "flat").

There's something to the immediacy of music notes when you have a planar driver 3" from your ear drum that the stereo lacks. And that in turn changes the perception of sound.

>It's not gonna be surprising at all considering the general market's gonna be looking for convenience first and foremost.

so much this.

>as long as audio companies have a say in the matter, as well as tech companies in general

uhmmm I disagree, most big headphones companies are getting bought out by even bigger tech companies, and these companies don't give a damn, they will produce whatever it's more popular with people, and push what it makes more money, in this case, wireless products. I don't think we're going to see any audio company defending wired products at all, if anything they will be ditching them "in silence" while they pretend that they still care for that reduced market (they don't lol)

While wireless audio has its uses (exercise is the biggest one), it's in every possible way inferior to wired audio. TWS earphones are overpriced, unrepairable devices with a lifespan of maximum a few years. Wires aren't even an actual issue outside of marketing materials.

yes, it was not an option, it was forced into people, but people liked it, so what are we gonna do? does enough people really care?

> too long didn't read: TWS earbuds are the only future for IEMs

Emphasis added. Be careful when using absolute statements. We're a community of psychos that put audio fidelity (whatever that means to each of us) above everything else.

> sales for wired products will not even make a shadow in the soon to become massive, wireless market.

That's already the case and has been the case ever since Apple released Airpods (if not sooner). But the wired IEM resurgence in the past 5ish years took place despite such a small market percentage wired IEMs make up.

lmaooo I can see that happening too.

latency in cheaper wireless products it's so bad that you can't even watch a movie because voices will be out of sync with what it's beign presented on the screen. that will change tho, the technology it's getting everyday better and cheaper, it will get to a point we're even cheap wireless headphones will have an unnoticeably latency

It’s why I’m not going down the IEM road, personally. I don’t like them for desktop listening, and would prefer wire free on the go. Everyone is different, but my S12 and Q5k will be the last on the go setup with wires for me. After this, I will go TWS. However, I think both will continue to exist, preferences and whatnot.

> there’s the convenience of seamlessly going from listening to music to talking with friends without switching the audio device.

So you have headphones on when talking to friends? In this situation wouldn't speakers be better so everyone can hear the music?

I mean discord and stuff, sorry should have worded that better

No one wants to hear music blasted through someone's microphone in mono over Discord or Zoom or whatever voice app you use.

>it's in every possible way inferior to wired audio

yeah, it is inferior, but NOT THAT inferior, the difference it's starting to become meaningless, most people won't care about EQ, frecuencies bands, or of the earbud is made of moon rocks, they want stilish shit with easy convenience.

I'd argue that they're overpriced, you can find good pairs of Lenovo TWS earbuds in AliExpress for less than 20$, and they're genuine and as I said, good enough for most.

>Emphasis added. Be careful when using absolute statements. We're a community of psychos that put audio fidelity (whatever that means to each of us) above everything else.

I know and I say the "only" future because there's no way around it. what are going to argue audio purist when the wireless technology finally overpass wired and is capable of reproducing music at the same fidelity if not better than wired earbuds?

also, the implementation of wireless headphones/earbuds has been very limited yet, there's tons of features that they could add but haven't, like having different factory fine tuned EQ attached to the earbud memory so users can select the one that they like the most from the get go instead of EQ themselves, or the earbuds beign able to recognize the genre that you're listening to, and changing the EQ on the go to the song that you're listening. I can see all of this and more happening in the future.

I'm going to be even more bold, wired iems are going to become soon the "dumb"phones of the headphone market. wireless WILL catch up, the arguments against it will become thinner and thinner with time, you just watch.

I agree with you and also do the same and plan to do the same.

sadly good smartphones aren't beign manufactured with headphones jacks anymore, there was an "outrage" of people, even regular consumers that got angry, but it was not nearly enough people to make a dent in apple sales or affect the market in any meaningful way.

wired IEMs will still exist in the future, but for a very reduced consumed market and not what were used to. I can even see chifi brands like KZ going only wireless in the future or releasing their own brand like CCA that will only focus in wireless. it will happen eventually...

>so what are we gonna do?

What's for us to do in this equation? I already said the popularity of wireless audio is the status quo.

>does enough people really care?

What if they do? The only option they have to continue on with their convenience is to keep buying new ones.

>they're BETTER for the average consumer than any wired IEMs

and? You know what was also for the average consumer? Apple wired earpods that came free with your phone. There has always been 2 distinct markets that have coexisted and these markets will continue to exist because the niche of audio is exactly that, a niche. There will always continue to be high end products like the Focal Utopia or Hifiman Susvara because they don't need to appeal to the general market and have been getting by just appealing to the niche because no average consumer will ever spend thousands on headphones.

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>The popularity, convenience or (eventual) quality of wireless audio is not the thing in question.

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>no average consumer will ever spend thousands on headphones.

they don't because apple or other mainstream company hasn't had the balls to charge thousands for headphones, but people are absolutely fine with paying a premium and beign overcharged, it gives them status

>no average consumer will ever spend thousands on headphones.

they don't because apple or other mainstream company hasn't had the balls to charge thousands for headphones, but people are absolutely fine with paying a premium and beign overcharged, it gives them status

Again, I get why people want wireless audio. That it will (and already has) become the default is a forgone conclusion. You don't have to convince me of the value of something which is already the default.

The cheap stuff often has QC issues, same as with the wired stuff, there are just many more points of failure for TWS.
Regardless, charging regularly is far more of an annoyance than a wire to me. I think it's totally sensible to keep around a TWS pair for going to the gym or running or whatever, but it could never replace wired earphones to me.

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Oh he meant talking with friends over the internet, not in person.

Did you know that the headphone jack came by default on most phones before apple decided to get rid of it on the iPhones?

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Low battery warnings, charging things, and latency are all a pain in the ass. I understand wanting wireless while traveling, but if you're spending most of your listening time at a desk then wired stuff turns out to be more convenient for a lot of people.

Having a headphone jack on your device doesn't automatically kill your bluetooth connection to your favourite wireless device. Having both on your device doesn't impede improvement to wireless technologies. It was a trojan horse because it was presented as an either or scenario. That you were getting something new or better in exchange for the loss of the headphone jack when that's just not true. Same with the longevity and repairability of TWS earbuds in exchange for the convenience of no wires. It is possible to make a product which fulfills both criteria yet it's being presented as an either or once again.

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But the market will cater to the average consumer, not the people here. So prepare yourselves...

Ok

I'm sure it's just a matter of time as well.

However, until we can get Susvara levels of uncompressed sound quality, on a weekly battery charge though, there are still many challenges up ahead. But I look forward to the day when something like this will happen - I just hope I'll still be around to experience it. :P

> I'm not seeing young people wanting to use wired headphones/IEMs either

Tell that to the celebrities and influencers:

https://www.nssmag.com/en/pills/28094/black-friday-2021

I think TWS can sound as good as IEMs but, there will always be people who will insist that wireless is trash whether they've tried Bluetooth at it's best or not. I often use IEMs with a wireless DAC/amp with LDAC, it sounds very similar to using a USB DAC, I find that the biggest factor in sound quality is the production of the music I'm listening to.

Cables >>>>>>>> wireless.

Until wireless can AT LEAST transmit 1411kbps+, and overcome the size limitations on how drivers and housing combine to achieve further true extension …. Or come close to the soundstage of real open back cans … they won’t stand a chance at overtaking the market share of true audiophiles, much less audio professionals.

Wires are absolutely an issue to many people. I understand audio quality is better with wires in general but when walking my dog the wires kept getting snagged on my coat, pulled out of my ears, and just prevented me fully rotating my head around and the experience absolutely killed any enjoyment of music for me. I think wired IEMS are absolutely better and if you have a desk job or have a situation where they don't bother you then they are the better investment, but if you want the convenience factor or any of the added bonuses like better a better mic or ANC then they are often worth it for those people.

Companies really love to make TWS since it is easy to manufacture and has relatively short lifespan compared to phones, etc. This way they ensure on consumer to buy one on the average of 2 years or so.

From the consumers side, there is value in convenience. Most people will definitely trade off SQ to get a pair of convenient TWS.

Which model Koss TWS earbuds do you have? Was interested in the 250i’s, have heard they sound like a combination of the Porta Pros and KSC75’s

you're on your lucky day bro, that's exactly the model that I got. and indeed, I've got both the porta pros and the ksc75s and can tell you that definitely koss wanted to play it safe with these IEMs because they got a sound profile really similar that those headphones, they're more similar to the porta pros than the ksc75s tho.

if they become good enough then there's no point using wired I guess

Try walking the dog and listening to nature.

I'll take my music and podcasts over the sound of cars and building work thanks. Not everyone lives in a national park unfortunately.

Midrange frequencies specifically are always better in wired

Understood!