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stephiereffie t1_ixz7jp9 wrote

Meanwhile next door is full of folks who complain about every single improvement that's made for cyclists or pedestrians.

Todays unhinged next door rant:

> I'm so sick of hearing DRIVERS NEED TO SLOW DOWN! yes we do and we're already doing 25mph and I. Some places 15..but when are we going to address and speak on the PEDESTRIANS and CYCLISTS that just dart out in front of moving traffic without looking up from their phones to MAKE SURE it's clear to proceed!..if I'm driving and traffic is flowing steadily behind me I can't just STOP ON A DIME because you just decide to run across! Because when I slow down unexpectedly it causes a chain reaction! The responsibility rest on both! Yes PEDESTRIANS have the right of way but they have to do the same as drivers and proceed with caution.

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Brawldud t1_ixzav2b wrote

imo when someone gets in a giant death machine and turns it on and starts flinging it at deadly speeds through densely populated areas for their own benefit, the responsibility lies with them to do no harm.

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Blightking t1_iy06p8q wrote

The law very much agrees with you

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Brawldud t1_iy08p6g wrote

Courts, law enforcement and public opinion are more inconsistent about this point unfortunately

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Blightking t1_iy0zytc wrote

Interested to read how the courts don’t agree. A speeding vehicle hitting a pedestrian should be a very simple tort matter

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Brawldud t1_iy19134 wrote

in the US frequently you can murder someone who was walking or biking with your car and as long as you stayed on scene and were not drunk you will face no consequences.

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Blightking t1_iy1aziy wrote

At minimum there's tort liability there, even considering contributory negligence. Wasn't able to find anything on westlaw or lexis you're describing. Do you have a specific case/incident/statute in mind?

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Quelcris_Falconer13 t1_iy2r1jo wrote

Did the pedestrian have the right of way to cross or were they jay walking?

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Blightking t1_iy2rg2l wrote

if right of way, the driver is completely at fault, if jay-walking, depending on the actions of the driver and the circumstances, the pedestrian would have contributory negligence.

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Quelcris_Falconer13 t1_iy2u0ap wrote

Yeah I know. I’ve seen a lady ina. Wheel chair get hit. She was ina cross walk but didn’t have the light. Rolled out in front of a truck and got hit when the light for the truck turned green. Driver didn’t see her directly in front of his vehicle and he hit and she flew. She was alright just bruised up and they called the cops and the cops said told her that because she was crossing without the light, she was at fault. She even admitted it was pretty stupid of her.

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Blightking t1_iy435kv wrote

no qualms with that result. pedestrians don't have the absolute right of way.

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Working-Grapefruit42 t1_iy16j5u wrote

Not if the pedestrian caused the accident… for example if a pedestrian runs out in the street where there’s no cross walk it’s not always the drivers fault. Any typically insurance will take care of it for cases where the pedestrian isn’t in the crosswalk or the driver isn’t “in the wrong”

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Blightking t1_iy1bl31 wrote

oh yeah if someone runs out into the street that's typically their fault. Basic negligence. A driver adhering to the law (not speeding, not texting [plaintiffs can request records of phone activity during the period in question to establish liability in discovery], etc.) obviously shouldn't face any legal liability.

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Working-Grapefruit42 t1_iy16bvh wrote

That’s not at all how physics works my good sir.

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Brawldud t1_iy1966e wrote

explain

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Working-Grapefruit42 t1_iy1bk0y wrote

The average breaking distance for a car going 15 miles an hour about 45 feet, and that’s assuming The driver saw the object while they were at least 30 feet away. and that’s for small cars with new breaks A lot of people don’t understand the math behind their everyday life when you are driving a car typically at 25mph you are going actually going about 37feet per second or about 12 meters per second. The average pedestrian pops out about 40-50 feet ahead of u. So there’s not much most drivers can do when someone pops out of nowhere the driver can’t just stop their car. Physics just doesn’t work to make the driver accountable for pedestrians because the relative speed of each object to so vastly different. Cars going the same speeds have a better chance of missing each other because of that relative speed everyone is kind of on the same plane but with cars and bikes they’re not moving close to the same relative speed so when they pop out thinking they can make it. They’re are not accurately judging what it takes for that “giant death machine” to stop moving and how fast it’s actually coming at them on pedestrians account

I hope that makes more sense for you

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noquarter53 t1_ixz87f8 wrote

Imma go out on a limb and say that people driving like maniacs, with zero moving violation accountability, are a bigger threat than lack of pedestrian safety measures.

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Turbo2x t1_ixzb1gi wrote

It's crazy that we spend so much time wringing our hands over every other type of crime or risk factor except cars when car injuries and fatalities are by far the easiest to identify and mitigate.

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Brickleberried t1_iy0a2ld wrote

Who is "we" here? This subreddit is chock full of "fuck cars" people.

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bubbameister33 t1_ixzvvd6 wrote

Next Door is a shithole though, a social media site for the worst of neighbors imaginable.

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iwasbornin2021 t1_iy08hcz wrote

The favorite social network of Karens (both male and female)

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stephiereffie t1_iy4vnw5 wrote

omg, the drama is insane there. Like the rants folks go one about are honestly kinda impressive. If you subscribe to /r/trashy it's a goldmine of material.

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[deleted] t1_ixzycdb wrote

[deleted]

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Brawldud t1_iy05c83 wrote

The way motorists describe it, you'd think that DC is some kind of reverse-guerrilla warfare battlefield, where cyclists and pedestrians are lying in ambush around every corner and crouched behind every waist-high object, waiting to spring out in front of them and commit suicide-by-car.

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Quelcris_Falconer13 t1_iy2qzki wrote

I mean the part about people be hind her being inconvenienced by stopping is stupid. She’s right about not being able to stop on a dime. The laws of physics say my 3,000lbs car needs a few hundred feet to stop and pedestrians are distracted by their phones and frequently step off the curb early. Or stand right on the edge with their toes and bellies hanging off around the tight corners.

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Complex-Marzipan-218 t1_iy0ej0e wrote

How are the other drivers who are tailgating me supposed to know to look up from their phone to break for the pedestrian?

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Brickleberried t1_ixzmqhv wrote

To be fair, bikers and pedestrians are also crazy. Sure, when they're crazy, they don't endanger other people as much as a crazy driver, but they endanger themselves. I can't count how many times I've seen a biker go through a red light or a pedestrian trying to walk through 4 lanes of ongoing traffic in the middle of a block.

Edit:

Bikers: "Too many of us are hurt or killed by bikers."

Me: "That is true, but bikers also commit dangerous acts that endanger themselves."

Bikers: "Fuck you. That doesn't matter."

I mean, if you want to protect bikers, you should accept all ways to protect bikers, not just ones that inconvenience other people.

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stephiereffie t1_ixzr3ib wrote

Nah, sorry. Not fair.

The problems that cars cause vs the problems that pedestrians or bikes cause are in such different magnitude, to bring it up is obviously not in good faith.

Cars kill people, bikes inconvence people.

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Professional-Can1385 t1_ixzuygy wrote

I can only control my actions, not any one else’s.

As a pedestrian who does not have a metal cage for protection, that means I try to be aware of cars and not do stupid stuff around them that could get me hurt.

Everyone has a responsibility to be safe, but you can’t control anyone else.

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Abitconfusde t1_ixzrype wrote

> Cars kill people

Whoa, there pal. Next you'll be saying that guns kill people. Settle down and think a little bit. Everybody knows that only people kill people. /s

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Brickleberried t1_iy00eqq wrote

Bikers risk their own lives when they don't follow the rules of the road.

Edit: I'm getting downvoted for this, but this is objectively correct. Bikers are so fucking mad that they're getting injured or killed, but also get mad when they're told to follow rules of the road that will help keep them safer. The people who do this are just whiny jackasses.

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stephiereffie t1_iy01y9g wrote

Okay, cool.

From my gooogling, looks like about 400 people died in single vehicle bicycle accidents in 2020.

On the other hand, 6516 pedestrians were mowed down by cars in 2020.

They're not comparable.

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Brickleberried t1_iy02ugv wrote

I'm not sure how that disproves my statement that both bikers and pedestrians can be crazy, which endangers their own lives.

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stephiereffie t1_iy0mgfx wrote

I'm not disproving it, I'm pointing out how inconsequential your statement is. Who gives a crap about the damage bicyclists do to themselves? We care about the damage cars can do to pedestrians.

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Brickleberried t1_iy0pxf2 wrote

> Who gives a crap about the damage bicyclists do to themselves?

So you don't actually care about the safety of bikers?

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stephiereffie t1_iy0s1k9 wrote

I think folks have the right to hurt themselves if they want.

That's obviously not the case when a car hits pedestrian.

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stephiereffie t1_iy0suzi wrote

>Edit: I'm getting downvoted for this, but this is objectively correct. Bikers are so fucking mad that they're getting injured or killed, but also get mad when they're told to follow rules of the road that will help keep them safer. The people who do this are just whiny jackasses.

Omg, no they're not. They're irritated when the conversation is "with all the traffic fatalities, how can we make the road infrastructure safer for cyclists and pedestrians? ", and some dude rolls in with "we don't need to change driving habits or our roads, the bikes need to stop running redlights!"

Like no crap dude, but let's spend more time working on the 6000 deaths.

Also, if you're getting down voted, take a look in the mirror and ask... Why?

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Brickleberried t1_iy102xl wrote

> and some dude rolls in with "we don't need to change driving habits or our roads,

I didn't say that though.

Y'all just don't like when you have to change how you operate too.

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SquishWindow t1_ixzxq90 wrote

> I've seen a biker go through a red light

This isn't crazy or dangerous unless there is cross traffic

> a pedestrian trying to walk through 4 lanes of ongoing traffic in the middle of a block.

If the pedestrian is at a crosswalk, the only thing that is "crazy" about them is expecting drivers to follow the law

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Brickleberried t1_iy007wx wrote

> This isn't crazy or dangerous unless there is cross traffic

lol, okay

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SquishWindow t1_iy00bi0 wrote

Have you ever looked both ways and jaywalked when there weren't any cars coming?

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Brickleberried t1_iy0100i wrote

So you think cars should be able to go through red lights too as long as they look both ways?

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SquishWindow t1_iy02t88 wrote

No, I don't.

Now answer my question - have you ever looked both ways and jaywalked when there weren't any cars coming?

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Brickleberried t1_iy09fht wrote

Of course. Why shouldn't I be able to do the same with a car though?

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stormcloudbros t1_iy0b902 wrote

Because a car typically weighs at least 3000 lbs and a driver has has far more limited ability to see or hear if they can safely cross than a person on foot, bike, or scooter.

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Brickleberried t1_iy0c2il wrote

It's actually pretty easy to see if anybody is approaching most of the time.

Edit: Well, since /u/stormcloudbros blocked me, I'll respond here:

> Then why do drivers keep getting in crashes?

That's a non sequitur. Thanks for playing.

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ccbmtg t1_iy06gip wrote

lmao and the good faith goes out the window.

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Brickleberried t1_iy09bkx wrote

How is the good faith out the window? The other person is saying it's not crazy for a biker to cross the street when nobody is looking because sometimes pedestrians jaywalk.

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ccbmtg t1_iy06ep8 wrote

it isn't. in fact, it's so normal that's it's outright on the books as legal in some states. it's called the Idaho stop. it must be commonplace in most areas so that they had to put it on record as legal.

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Brickleberried t1_iy09d48 wrote

Is it legal here?

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SquishWindow t1_iy0f06t wrote

Jaywalking is illegal here. Do you believe that jaywalking after you look both ways and see no cars coming is "crazy and dangerous"?

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Brickleberried t1_iy0jiti wrote

No more than cars doing it.

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SquishWindow t1_iy0muol wrote

Do you believe pedestrians jaywalking after looking both ways is "crazy and dangerous"? How come you can't give a clear yes or no answer to that very simple question?

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Brickleberried t1_iy0pr8i wrote

I'm saying it's the same for cars, bikes, and pedestrians. If you're going to say it's not crazy for pedestrians, I'm going to say it's not crazy for cars, and vice versa.

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SquishWindow t1_iy0qa52 wrote

You can't say whether it's crazy and dangerous for pedestrians to jaywalk after looking both ways? How can you be so confident in your argument when you can't even stand up to one simple yes or no question? That's pretty weak sauce.

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TRIGMILLION t1_iy0bf38 wrote

I try to be a good careful driver but when it's pitch dark out and you're riding your bike in black clothes with no reflective lights anywhere it really enrages me. I don't actually want to kill you but when the only reason I even notice you is a little glint of light coming off your wheels give me a break. I'm not speeding recklessly either but I've seen squirrels dart across the street more carefully than some of these people.

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Brickleberried t1_iy0cj6m wrote

Bikers in this subreddit: "How dare you say that bikers could do anything on their own to be safer!"

Just last week, I had a biker run a red light as I turning. Would have hit them if I hadn't hit the breaks. But most fuck cars people would blame me for that.

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