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jl_theprofessor t1_ir38bd9 wrote

Oh this is fascinating. So Magnus wasn't bullshitting. Not that it would have been like him to do so, but the fact that it's bearing out is crazy.

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sudifirjfhfjvicodke t1_ir3h9t9 wrote

Yeah, I don't follow competitive chess at all, so when I first heard about the allegations, I just rolled my eyes and figured Carlsen was just a huge crybaby. But the more I read about this, the more I'm convinced that he knew exactly what he was talking about.

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quick20minadventure t1_ir53029 wrote

Magnus is the top most authority on how humans play chess. He is not just gifted, he works insanely hard and he got to the top by being extremely unforgiving and harsh on himself when he made mistakes.

The idea that magnus was being a crybaby was always a joke for people familiar. And he's completely justified in drawing a line and saying he'll not play against people who cheated online or offline repeatedly.

His response and chess.com report are both extremely nuanced and very professional. People just got impatient.

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jorge1209 t1_ir52fy4 wrote

Carlsen may have had insider information from chess.com due to a financial transaction between his chess website and chess.com.

I don't know the terms of that deal or if it was all cash or had some stock involved.

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ethan52695 t1_ir4pm7m wrote

Well to be fair the article really only provided strong evidence for him cheating online. Much of which he admitted to. They found irregularities in his over the board play and with his rise in ranking, but it’s still possible that he wasn’t cheating when playing against magnus. That being said it definitely doesn’t look good for him. From what I’ve read there has been a lot of speculation from many top players in the chess community that he had been cheating for some time.

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McKFC t1_ir51kgv wrote

>Much of which he admitted to.

He admitted to cheating when he was 12 and 16. This is far beyond the scope, which is the newsworthy part, because it shows that he continues to lie about cheating in the past.

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quick20minadventure t1_ir52glq wrote

Dude said he cheated twice at 12 and 16 year old in insignificant games when there was no cash prize, no streaming and 'no real matches'.

All off them were proved wrong. He cheated a lot more, much more recently and in much more serious competition.

Magnus was 100% right when he said hans cheated more and more recently than he admitted to.

It's one thing to cheat in random game, another to cheat in prizepool events and entirely another thing to downplay cheating you already confessed about on live television and insult people who gave you second chance.

I read 72 page report, hans cheated a lot and fucked up massively. Only thing helping him is that chess.com explicitly says that they don't have expertise in catching longer format and over the board cheating because they usually deal with short online games only.

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RageA333 t1_ir5dtwg wrote

How do we know he cheated beyond that? Edit: beyond when he was 12 and 16

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quick20minadventure t1_ir5easu wrote

Chess.com has listed 100 games. Their evidence has been concrete enough that he confessed as well. He said he had to cheat to gain more viewers and followers online in email with chess.com and Chess.com published that email.

He confessed that he made conscious decision to cheat against top players to gain followers on twitch/streaming.

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Oscar-Wilde-1854 t1_ir5f14h wrote

It's one of those things where it doesn't really matter at this point. It's essentially the "once a cheater, always a cheater" mantra.

Imagine a professional athlete getting caught doping. Like Lance Armstrong in cycling. Then imagine they just let him compete in the Tour de France the year after and he dominates again.

No amount of blood testing would ever make people believe Lance isn't cheating somehow. He proved he was a cheater and he proved he could get away with it under scrutiny.

Same thing here. It's been proven he's cheated and a lot more than he admitted to when questioned. Thus he's "a cheater".

He may legitimately be worthy of the rank he holds these days, but no opponent (or fan) will trust him ever again. Does chess as a whole want a world champion who might be a cheater? Nope.

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shaggypotato0917 t1_ir51kdj wrote

Nothing against most of your comment, I just want to point out that he actually hasn't admitted to most of his cheating, especially if the article is to be believed.

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Sendstorepatter t1_ir4x7x9 wrote

I think the fact that people think he might have used a USB connected bum dildo that vibrated his next moves is hilarious to me. Like "C3, bzzzt bzt bzt bzt".

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[deleted] t1_ir56eru wrote

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[deleted] t1_ir59oq5 wrote

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[deleted] t1_ir5a3he wrote

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revgames_atte t1_ir5hqar wrote

  1. Big drama drops about Hans' past as a cheater on Chess.com after Magnus withdraws from the tournament and rumors start spreading (from sources other than Magnus)

  2. Chess.com boots him due to his participation while there is ongoing cheating related drama possibly lowering the faith of players and spectators in the million dollar tournament

  3. Hans "confesses" to his past cheating while downplaying what he was caught for and admitted to.

  4. Chess.com shows receipts.

Chess.com involvement didn't start from Magnus withdrawing from the tournament. It started after many big figures started speculating and making it more widespread knowledge that Hans does indeed have a past of cheating on the site.

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TheOneWithNoName t1_ir3hpmy wrote

Magnus still may not be justified. He accused Hans of cheating in live over-the-board matches and has provided exactly 0 proof of this. This article is only about his online history, though it is pretty damning to Hans reputation either way.

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jimdotcom413 t1_ir3swdw wrote

Did he not resign out of protest in that match because he knows what a cheater Hans is and refused to play against him? There was one move in that match so it’s not like you could accuse the person of cheating in that match alone.

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TheOneWithNoName t1_ir3tep2 wrote

Magnus had played against Hans several times before with knowledge that he was an online cheater, but only refused to play him after losing a match. He quit that match after one move because he was suspicious of their previous games.

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politickinninja t1_ir47nuz wrote

You're thinking of the second game(online), after Magnus got his ass whooped in the first(OTB).

Hans cheated online and probably shouldn't be allowed in online tournaments but there is 0 evidence of him cheating OTB.

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elpajaroquemamais t1_ir4xplc wrote

He didn’t quit because he was cheating in that particular game. He quit after a move. He quit because he didn’t want to be beat by someone who could be cheating.

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Morkins324 t1_ir62gcp wrote

I feel like Magnus is reasonably justified regardless. He might not have actual proof of Hans cheating OTB, but he probably was reasonably aware of the repeated cheating online. And then he played a game against Hans OTB where Hans made some strange moves that seem more like engine moves rather than human moves(given Hans rating). I feel like that was enough to create a situation where Magnus is reasonably justified in pulling out of that tournament. Even if he can't prove what happened in the OTB game and even if Hans wasn't actually cheating in the OTB game, I don't blame Magnus for not wanting to play against Hans. He is already suspicious of Hans going into the match given the online history, and then had a weird match OTB...

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