TheJester0330

TheJester0330 t1_j8ygcsx wrote

I mean magical realism is sort of inherently absurd, that's the point of it. You can't really play straight with a grounded, realistic world while simultaneously introducing some fantastical, mythical, or otherwise supernatural elements.

It sounds like you just don't care for magical realism as a whole which is fine, but I don't think there's too much more to it than you simply don't like what the genre entails. Master and the Margarita is one of my favorite books, a prime example of magical realism.... And also is theatrically absurd because again that's the main crux of the genre aside from a plethora of social/cultural/political critiques. The magical aspect is purposely absurd to contrast against the realism.

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TheJester0330 t1_j6el8oo wrote

Because the Greek culture I was referring to is Classical Greece. Paul would've come about 500 years after that, who while born in the Mediterranean area, would've lived with Roman culture. Already within the Roman Empire there is subtle changes to same sex relationships, the Roman Empire is heavily steeped in tradition, much of what dictated what was socially acceptable was based on perceived honor, virtue, liberty, and family. As such male-on-male sexual relationships were fine within certain stipulations. A Freeborn man could have sex with another man if 1) The free-born man was penetrating and 2) the other man was of a "lower class", i.e a slave, a prostitute, etc. Any one else and it would be constitute a loss of status for the one taking, and in Roman society it can't be overstated how important status was. Of course this isn't to say all homosexual relations were purely based on power or that there couldn't be a romantic/sexual relationship between men of equal class, but most as perceived within the society followed traditional views.

With Paul again he's already several hundred years past the point I was intially talking about, and of course just because someone lives in a specific area/culture doesn't mean that they can't hold ideas of their own differing from said culture. However the empires stance on same sex relationships would of course change as it gradually became more Christian before being a Christian empire, with male prostitution being outlawed not long after Paul died, anal penetrating would result at being burned, etc but this is rambling from the point. The earliest times we see this change on same sex relationships is with the first Christian polemics (such as Paul) who preached on the vices of Rome decadence with a core critique being same sex relationships as a "sin". Christianity as a whole was considered radical for the time given the Roman culture so it's not really a surprise that Paul would similarly hold a different view of same sex relationships then what was then accepted.

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TheJester0330 t1_j69qf2z wrote

There isn't really a singular "point" in which it became unacceptable. You can trace it back to, as someone else said, Paul's time, but cultures have varied on tolerance. What's probably more important is that homosexuality as we understand it is very recent, sure the Greeks are known for their relationships but they won't understand it as being homsexual or same sex. Relationships in their times were based on power, it was based on who was giving and who was receiving, there was a very strict hierarchy of power in those acts.

So with that understanding male platonic relationships were never viewed in a sexual way because relationships were not based around being attracted to the same gender but to the power being used in that relationship

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TheJester0330 t1_j69079u wrote

I disagree, his opinions on the music are shallow, and often miss the point. To use Hip to Be Square, Patrick sees it as a song about conformity, about how it's better to fit in then be an individual or buck the status quo.

Huey Lewis wrote the song satirically, it's meant to make fun if "squares" as it comments are people losing what makes them unique. Patrick doesn't understand this though because like everything ss he can only understand the surface level interpretation

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TheJester0330 t1_j1w6ks0 wrote

If you're interested in general to diving into the Illiad, I'd highly recommend Achilles in Vietnam by Jonathan Shay.

Its nothing like the Song of Achilles (personally I didn't care much for it or it's YA nature though I can understand why it appeals to others), but if you're interested in a deeper understanding of the Illiad as well as exploring the social and cultural themes throughout it, I'd highly recommend it.

Its a non-fiction comparative work, analyzing how Homer explores topics such as trauma, morality, purpose, and self-worth by comparing it to his own studies (Jonathan Shay is a clinical psychiatrist) of PTSD in Vietnam Veterans. It's tragic and powerful, as it compares Homer's description of loss and PTSD to the modern day, showcasing how (to little surprise but interesting to read nonetheless) America often fails in providing support and care for not only veterans but those suffering from PTSD in general as well as discussing the consequences of suppressing emotion and mourning.

Highly recommend it, while having read the Illiad is helpful it's not required as any relevant passages being discussed have excerpts and background information provided

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TheJester0330 t1_isu9sdy wrote

I think there's plenty of character focused Sci-fi, I'd just say the difference is that it's more of a 50/50 split of character driven and thematically driven. Like Dune is probably good example where it's core is the themes, the critique of imperialism, prophecies, a white savior,, and a very strong ecological focus, etc. Characters can tend to be more secondary to the themes it's trying to convey which is common as scifi is often used a way to critique and comment current society or the path society could be heading down. Where as - while there are exceptions - fantasy tends to lean more towards pure escapism with some vague or more general social themes.

A few people have already brought up some good recommendations, Urusla LeGuin is an excellent choice. She wrote both scifi and fantasy with fantastically fleshed our characters and their journeys that also happened to tie in with some larger ideas.

A few of my own recommendations would be the Metro Trilogy by Dmitry Glukhovsky. It's post apocalyptic and pretty bleak as far as the world goes but it's all character driven. The first and third books follow Artyom, initially a very sheltered young man who dreams of the outside world but knows nothing about it. The first book is essentially his growth as a person, learning about the beauty and horror in equal measure of life. The third book jumps ahead several years and is similarly a character driven story but acts as a deconstruction of the post journey hero. Once the "grand quest" for the hero has been completed, what's left? It explores a lot more by in terms of his character story its much darker with hints of optimism but is similarly entirely driven but his character and experiences.

By the same author is Futu.re, which explores a world where a vaccine has been developed against aging. This leads to number of unintended consequences such as overpopulation, increasing wealth disparity, conflict with religion, purpose, and the like. To combat over population a law has been put in place that if a couple wishes to have a child, one of the parents must give up their immortality to attempt to keep the population stable. However it's a not a flawless system and so to enforce the law, a paramilitary group is formed that forces both parents to give up their immortality or face immediate death. The story follows a member of this paramilitary group as he wanders aimlessly through life and is becoming increasingly disillusioned with the world he lives in. While there are grander events unfolding around him, he himself doesn't really play a part in them as the story is more personally focused on his own life and struggles.

Other good character driven stories would be On the Beach by Nevil Shute that is entirely driven by characters and emotion, there isn't really an "overarching" story more just a gut wrenching portrayal of people living the final months of their lives.

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