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OraclesPath00 t1_jebyb5s wrote

What I find comically sad about this is....this strategy is being used against all wealth classes aside from the wealthy elites. It started to transition in the USA in the middle of the 70's. They literally found another way to get indentured servitude from the masses and have them smile thinking they are living the "dream". No one can afford to push back as they stagnate wages, increase the only avenue to live through credit slavery, slowly changed laws transfer wealth and power to corporations and wealthy elites, made laws against protests, bought news agencies for informational control, monetized our health to a disgusting degree, destroyed the landscape of unions, outsourced jobs to countries they pay pittance....and now can strong are the lower, middle, and reasonable higher class anytime they want. It is a fucking shame so many dont see what they have done. They got tired of the historical cycle when the masses get wiser....this time they gave a nice grace period to everyone in the early 20th century. And after that they created the near perfect system to keep the masses from uprising as they historically do because the wealthy elites arent smart....just a bunch of dragon selfish bitches who covet gold over the lives of their fellow man.

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needabra129 t1_jecg0k6 wrote

It’s so true. I think about this constantly and wonder - how are we not rioting in the streets over this? Pulling a Boston tea party and dumping oil…. somewhere that would render it useless without damaging the environment. Going on nationwide strikes to demand better pay, benefits, and worker rights. I’d like to think we are getting to that point, but god damn we are slow. The French would have rioted decades ago if this happened there lol

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Parafault t1_jecgl0j wrote

Without unions, no one wants to be “the one” who takes the risk of losing their job. Even if you feel you’re being treated unfairly and paid like garbage, without said pay your life would be a lot worse.

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needabra129 t1_jecijpq wrote

Which is why we need to unionize. And it’s happening, but slowly. I predict legislation in the next 5 years that enables all workers to actually unionize, and I think people will do it. People don’t believe the anti-union propaganda anymore… it’s gotten to the point that even if unions were run by the mafia, it would still be better than the zero rights we currently have that continue to be stripped away.

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megustaALLthethings t1_jednzbz wrote

I’ve said that for the longest time and the bootlickers get all huffy and puffy. As if the literal mafia is worse than these wealth vampires sitting behind their armored and legion protected fortresses.

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non-euclidean-ass t1_jedbyvd wrote

We have been! The BLM protests, Occupy Wall Street, Stop Cop City, when we do riot we get shot in the face with beanbag bullets and tear gassed and arrested and charged with felonies

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Ancient_Artichoke555 t1_jed9sz2 wrote

Even sicker is we won’t for a change. And “they” know it. We aren’t even a concern for “them.”

I come from revolutionaries bloodline and generationally.

The LAST time I had hope for the much overdue American revolution was when we all watched Egypt do it on live cnn.

I thought, perhaps america was a tactile learner, such as myself, and just needed to see it in action, to see what it will take to make changes.

I fear our time has passed. “They” will watch us do the same, to eachother in civil wars amongst ourselves. Only a real live version of hunger games with a rat race movie undertone to it. Is my suspicion at this point of these upcoming times.

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DeeHawk t1_jedkcvg wrote

>destroyed the landscape of unions

This thing alone is proof enough that they prefer corporate control over worker rights. I do not want to know where my country would be without unions. Squinting at U.S, it doesn't look great for the little guy.

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tacit_urn t1_jed8hux wrote

Apple? Meet Orange.

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Lirvan t1_jedfqha wrote

For real. This comment has nothing to do with the article. The article is speaking of China's belt and road initiative for developing countries' infrastructure investments. Not US-based citizen credit/debt cycles.

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ottawacanuk t1_jeey5id wrote

I agree with almost everything you say. I hate credit and credit cards, but I am almost forced to used them by my bank. I could go back to cash I guess, but in this world some companies don't even take that. My credit union charges me to use a debit card, but I can use a credit card unlimited with continued higher limits which we don't ask for. Debt slavery by no other terms.

On unions though, I have recently moved to Canada with my canadian wife. Never belonged to unions before. I work as a professional and I have to say, many people here think it is the utopia of work. It is so not in my experience. I have to start at the bottom again, because experience means nothing in these unions. It's all about seniority - who started at the company first. I have people half my age, with half my experience and knowledge who started 15 years ago earning three times as much as me. It doesn't matter how hard I work, I will never get ahead. The union is led by 'senior' employees who just look out for themselves. It is an old boys club, so if anyone else runs, they gang up on them and make their lives difficult.

I am now earning less than I was 30 years ago. The company can treat us like sh$t because they know we can't move anywhere else, because we will have to start at the bottom again.

Experience, knowledge and meritocracy mean nothing here.

In my experience, unions are the worst thing that ever happened to me and my family and for the first time in my life I can see myself working at walmart after retirement just to survive.

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Strange-Bee5626 t1_jedo6mt wrote

So well-put that I saved a screenshot to digest again later. You basically hit the nail on the head here.

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Card_Zero t1_jedqvbc wrote

This is a conspiracy theory.

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Strange-Bee5626 t1_jee6pat wrote

Thank you for your valuable input.

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Card_Zero t1_jee7jcf wrote

Are you being sincere, or sarcastic? I'm aware that each argument should be taken on its merits, but you might consider that the quality of this theory about a vague wealthy elite who engaged in various evil manipulations over a vague span of time is comparable to other theories that the same person has about UFOs (or UAPs, as the cranks call them these days in order to avoid looking like cranks). This question remains unanswered.

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Xoxrocks t1_jeengff wrote

It’s not that: it’s regulatory and legislative capture. The system is built such that companies that don’t exploit workers to increase profits or mitigate pollution will be out-competed. There is no overarching power grab, just a system that serves corporate profits rather than people. Tie that to regulations that are made by corporations and bought elections means that it pays to suck as much money out of people into corporations.

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Oxon_Daddy t1_jefgj7b wrote

What you and the parent commenter are saying are different things.

You are saying that "the system" is structured to oppress workers, but there is no "overarching power grab"; you are not positing that there is a conspiracy among the elites to subjugate and oppress the proletariat.

The parent commenter is making that claim. He claims that the "elites" or "wealthy classes" have coordinated over time to implement a "strategy" (in his words) to create the structure of the system to subjugate and oppress the proletariat; he also claims in other comments that they pay for media and commenters on social media to produce misinformation to conceal that fact.

It is a conspiracy theory, and you were duped into defending it by passing it off as something that it is not.

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Card_Zero t1_jeeoqev wrote

Regulatory capture is a thing. And the comment could have been about that. It could have been about anything. It should have been about a debt trap of some kind, but who knows really, read into it what you like. Lots of people seemed to enjoy the sound and feel of it.

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Oxon_Daddy t1_jecff8e wrote

Sophisticated whataboutism designed to appeal to Redditors' biases.

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ThermalPasteSucks t1_jedru7s wrote

And this is unsophisticated deflection designed to appeal to the global elites' or deranged citizens' biases.

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OraclesPath00 t1_jecjkfu wrote

Mmmmmm, it's funny you said that. I was very lucky born into the family I have. They stressed morality and a duty to help others if you have the means. Not for a pat on the back or for show in social circles. And it has allowed me to see the side that hasnt been cultivated for a public audience. The wealthy elite use social media to divide the public and create ghost enemies all the time. They have an army of people they pay to come here on reddit and look for key words. Then they start commenting to try and start fires and separate discussion of a VERY clear focused operation to keep that divide wide. How do I know? Because I have people in that world and have been around others who do these things. There are even rules in the wealthy class where you are required to remain silent on the things I speak of. Nothing I previously wrote out is wrong and in fact it's very accurate. So anyone reading this who is a earnest person...ask yourself who is making those comments that try and counter or get you to iqnore what I said....because it is those same people who have created this corrupted system. And they dont want everyone getting together as one team of the many vs the 100 millionaire and billionaire few. The past is a map to this cycle...we need to start showing them for the last time, they arent in charge

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Card_Zero t1_jedqd57 wrote

Do you also claim that the wealthy elite are involved in covering up non-human intelligence visiting from another reality, or is that an unrelated group?

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circ_le_jerk_69 t1_jecqpmn wrote

> How do I know? Because I have people in that world and have been around others who do these things.

and then everyone clapped?

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OraclesPath00 t1_jecyu6t wrote

Nope. Mentioned it for the crowd who scream "how would you know?". I dont associate with that side of my family much anymore. What's funny though is someone like yourself who avoids the important points of what I'm saying to make some stupid wishful zinger that does literally nothing to contribute to this huge problem society is facing.one reason they get away with the wealth transfer is because of the bucket of crabs concept. You would be one of those people who cant stand others overcoming something, so you sabotage them and yourself....and get stuck in that bucket. Maybe next time if you have to make some attempt at a joke, you could make it more like yourself and it should be tip marks

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circ_le_jerk_69 t1_jed05px wrote

I just thought it was funny how you were making up a story about how you have wealthy acquaintances who pay armies of people to post on Reddit. You have a fanciful imagination I must say. Not too different from the Pizzagate people.

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mukansamonkey t1_jedzz07 wrote

Lol you think rich people can't afford media campaigns? A couple of wealthy right wingers own Fox News and a group of related propaganda sites, explicitly founded with the goal of lying to the American public. To protect right wing politicians. And you think a guy who makes a billion dollars a year is somehow incapable of hiring a few people to post on Reddit?

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Oxon_Daddy t1_jee5ua9 wrote

Whether or not what you have said is true (and I don't think that it is, but we can assume that it is true for the sake of argument), it is an obvious case of whataboutism.

The article concerns allegations that China is extending loans to low-income countries that they cannot service and using their debt to exert influence over them.

That analogies can or cannot be drawn about the relations between elite and proletariat classes within nations does not address, and merely distracts, from the subject of the article.

If elite classes are oppressing the proletariat as your comment implies, that is bad; but that is not a reason not to address credible allegations that China engages in "debt trap" diplomacy to influence impoverished nations.

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