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qpwoeor1235 t1_iujie3y wrote

A bird in the hand is worth two in the Native American cultural and religious purposes

−49

reddit455 t1_iujl0bq wrote

Replying to qpwoeor1235 (#401,288)

I guess you're not really clear on what's actually going on here.

birds shed.

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Alaska Eagles Supply Feathers to Lower 48 Tribes

https://alaskapublic.org/2015/06/03/alaska-eagles-supply-feathers-to-lower-48-tribes/

That’s because the raptor center collects feathers rehabilitating birds lose while molting.

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“Our education birds that are here year-round, when they drop their feathers, we collect those. And they all just get saved up and I can send them down there,” she says.
“There” is the National Eagle Repository, run by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service near Denver, Colorado.

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Only Alaskan Natives and American Indians are allowed to gather, store and use feathers or parts from eagles and some other protected birds — with a few exceptions.

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decrementsf t1_iujm6wt wrote

Infantilization alive and well. Teach a man to fish and they'll never come back. Make a man dependent? They'll feed you forever.

−83

gramathy t1_iujqdtk wrote

Replying to decrementsf (#402,759)

Infantilisation? This is for preservation of the eagles which would otherwise be extinct at this point, not “be a good boy and well give you feathers. If it wasn’t incredibly illegal to even posess I guarantee poachers would have wiped them out to make shitty “authentic” souvenirs.

The feathers are provided to preserve cultural heritage not to make anyone dependent on anyone else.

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decrementsf t1_iujr3bg wrote

Replying to Informal-Ideal-6640 (#404,039)

My argument is to return dignity. Insulting to treat adults like children to be protected and coddled in the world. Dependency is a mental prison of another design. The tyrannical mother of affluent families smother and control their children through such dependencies, resulting in stunted growth and infantile princelings.

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SaxyOmega90125 t1_iujsd01 wrote

Replying to decrementsf (#404,867)

That's not going to happen as long as Native Americans are caged in tiny reserves.

A solution that might be preferable to this would be to allow Natives to gather bird of prey feathers and remains on land currently claimed by the US proper. That being said, these eagles are already shedding feathers while in these rehabilitation and reintroduction programs. Would it be better to waste those feathers than to give them freely to Native American groups that will use them?

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Mosenji t1_iujt2ql wrote

Replying to gramathy (#404,543)

This center was founded in the early 70s when eagle populations were rapidly declining in the lower 48 because their eggshells were too thin to survive thanks to DDT everywhere. Extinction there was a real possibility, besides being a national black eye would be another cultural blow on Indians.

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decrementsf t1_iuju5c7 wrote

Replying to gramathy (#404,543)

The fur trade in 1700s America was the first to develop conservation regulations to protect their industry. This was spurred by observation in resource decline as prolific expansion transformed the frontiers. Populations rebounded and today those protocols developed have restored wildlife in parts of the US comparable to when the country first discovered. The consequence of less hunting and migratory trends to cities in the last few generations is that in the suburban to rural boundaries animal populations are growing rapidly.

It's an insult to pretend Native American's are incapable of sustainably running conservation programs. There is generational knowledge of maintaining wildlife populations there as well. We have a hundred years of strategy development. The doors to higher education are open to all. They can afford people education for top notch consulting of those programs without the hand-holding.

−1

decrementsf t1_iujv5no wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#405,125)

Not particularly. Native Americans are the winning team.

The Romans arrived in Britain and killed everyone. Then ran towns and turned Britain into the jewel of the empire leaving behind a cultural and scientific tradition. The picts, the scotti, raided and killed everyone. Before settling and building trade routes to benefit of all. The Saxons arrived and killed everyone. Before settling in and building out trade, cultural and scientific advances of their own. The vikings arrived and killed everyone. Before making settlements supporting trade routes and intermingled into the resulting culture to come out of that.

We're all interspersed. The Native-Anglo-Scottish-Prussian-Somali of America. We're a pirate colony. There is no nation on earth we can not provide talent to be competitive against. There is no other country that have that same resiliency, they thrive competitively in one or two industries -- but not all. By also offering the greatest individual freedom of any country on earth that's a powerful draw to skim off the top 1% everywhere. They all come to risk and compete trying the pirate life. To come and kill and conquer in the most brutal competitive system. But then intermingle and blend in sharing cultural and scientific best-of mix.

Excluding anyone from the pirate ship is evil. We all benefit from contributions of the best-of from all peoples. This is the merit of diversity. The winning team takes the best from all and repurposes it to their own advantage.

−1

ChevExpressMan t1_iujyj5t wrote

Replying to Mosenji (#406,837)

It's to deter those who would willingly kill eagles so "collectors" could posses such and thus, prohibit us non-native greedy shits from making money.

Believe it that there's B.I.G. money in the illicit animal trade.

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Randvek t1_iuk32io wrote

Makes sense. This way, the tribes can get the feathers they need without having to hunt a protected species.

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South_Data2898 t1_iuk3una wrote

Covid aid for native Americans? Fuck that. Basic healthcare? Fuck that too. Education assistance? Double fuck that, don't want the browns to get too uppity and start asking for more rights.

Want to build an oil pipeline right through their backyard? By all means, have at it.

Oh yeah, they can have some feathers too. Wonderful.

2

horsemagicians t1_iuk73zi wrote

Replying to SaxyOmega90125 (#405,411)

Because allowing that creates a risk of the birds being hunted just for feathers. Being native doesn’t automatically make them some mystical group of people that watch over the land. It’s a group of people just like any other group of people. And when you get a group of people inevitably you’ll get assholes. And in this case those assholes will decide to shoot birds for feathers and sell them. Where I am we have different tribes fighting for and against coal mining on their lands. Some see dollar signs some see protecting nature.

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memberzs t1_iuk9cyf wrote

Replying to Randvek (#410,380)

the bald eagle is neither endangered nor threatened, like it was previously. It only remains protected because its the national bird. Also native Americans aren't poaching in great quantity for their ceremonial uses. this is solely so the federal government can extend control over native Americans and their free exercise of religion.

they could simply give an exemption to the protected status to tribe members instead of make them get what they need from the federal government.

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