jagdpanzer45 t1_iuwj0ek wrote
Reply to comment by Chris_90_TO in Denver firefighters suspended for getting woman pronounced dead even though she was alive by xraygun2014
Unions are for workers to negotiate with their bosses. They’re for all workers.
Chris_90_TO t1_iuwjx7w wrote
I understand that, but they also add a burden to the employer and customer. I see unions as necessary to protect basic rights and safety, but we have laws for that, so unions are really just looking at salaries and benefits. That's a human resource responsibility. A good employer will provide good benefits and salary to attract and keep good employees. An employer that has to deal with a union has to provide good benefits and salary for all mediocre employees.
jagdpanzer45 t1_iuwkv73 wrote
Historically, almost every advancement for workers has been made by unions. Why should workers trust the law when corporations have much more sway over the people making those laws? Why shouldn’t workers join together to protect their own interests?
Chris_90_TO t1_iuwl84a wrote
Why should the tax dollars of Denver residents go to mediocre firefighters? (that are protected by a union)
jagdpanzer45 t1_iuwlg8s wrote
Because they do their jobs? Because fires being allowed to spread is bad for the community? Because even a ‘mediocre’ firefighter is still fighting fires and saving lives?
Chris_90_TO t1_iuwmhgv wrote
Anyway my understanding of the article is at the police and the firefighters were all incompetent and they get to hide behind their union. If society keeps mediocracy around we will continue to be a mediocre society.
jagdpanzer45 t1_iuwomld wrote
Incompetence and mediocrity are two very different things. If you’re mediocre you’re still doing your job. If you’re incompetent you’re not doing your job. These firefighters were horribly negligent. The police officer, however, was incompetent.
In the case of the union, these firefighters are getting protections because of the principle that everyone deserves a “day in court”. They’re getting a second chance to not fuck up, but should they fuck up again any time within the next five years they will be fired.
immibis t1_iv4w5vo wrote
Spoiler alert: none of the employers are "good employers"
And there aren't competing fire departments
Chris_90_TO t1_ivgr6md wrote
I've never thought about that... there are no "competing fire departments" 🤔 other cities will have other fire departments though, but not always reasonable for people to move far for jobs.
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