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CaptainJackJ t1_iuq3rw6 wrote

Reply to comment by Obsolete-Prototype in [Image] The Maturity Climb by raytanwl

Feels more destructive than half the stuff on the bottom. No real solution to “I’m the problem with the world”

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Bucket1982 t1_iuq5rnt wrote

Sure there is, you focus on changing you, not changing the world.

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BHBachman t1_iuqe0fi wrote

Which is fine if you're trying to focus on sticking to a diet or keeping your house clean, but is absolute dogshit when it comes to dealing with all of my bills doubling or facing bankruptcy because I went to the hospital.

Seeing society as an unchanging morally-neutral thing that isn't worth confronting or trying to change for the better at all isn't mature. It's selfish, short sighted, and only allows for a further worsening of said world.

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Enovalen t1_iuqex35 wrote

You don't get it. You're to blame for the unending hedonistic, greed-driven world we live in. You had the gall to come out in this world as a living, breathing, exoloitable human being.

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Bucket1982 t1_iuqpe1n wrote

Once again you’re making it about “you” and not, “you changing for the world”. The world does not change for you. This leaves only one option.

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BHBachman t1_iuqq9pu wrote

Yes and my point is that "The world doesn't change for you" is a shitty, defeatist message that offloads all societal responsibility onto some vague "other" (or in some cases, just treats a terrible world as a noble and just thing that somehow proves how good it is). I know it's called the "is-ought distinction" in philosophy but I prefer the more general term "normative-descriptive shuffle". If your response to "This thing is bad" is to point out that that's just how things are, then all you're doing is carrying water for the people who make it bad in the first place. Think bigger.

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ChanimalCrackers t1_iusjrok wrote

I think the picture needed to make a point in as few words as possible due to space limitations. There are bound to be some nuances that can’t be communicated.

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Bucket1982 t1_iuqr5cr wrote

To reflect and have understanding about something doesn’t mean you stay in that headspace forever. You are not locked in to any of those things at the top of the picture. Realizing your real power is in changing yourself doesn’t mean you don’t also try to shape the world around you. Knowing it is an impossible task doesn’t make humans stop trying.

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paulstefan t1_iuruvsk wrote

The world often is fucked up by choices that are beyond and before my actions. Just saying: stop changing the world" sometimes feels more like suck it up and accept the fucked up nature of our world.

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Bucket1982 t1_iurvkjd wrote

Well that is true to an extent. I’m certainly not going to let it eat me alive. I have known the world will never be perfect, and accepted that it will always need to be worked on. It doesn’t mean I’m against working on it, just don’t expect perfection.

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paulstefan t1_iurw0fd wrote

The trick is to accept it enough to not let it eat at you but to still want to change it.

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Bucket1982 t1_iurwbz7 wrote

That I agree with. For the most part, but we only have true power over ourselves. You do not have power over other people, and you never will.

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paulstefan t1_iuscnpb wrote

This is not true. The power other people have over us that we are calling as "the way the world is" is the ultimate proof.

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Bucket1982 t1_iutakdi wrote

That’s not from people working together against you. That is a conglomeration of everyone who will always be competing to be on top. There is not some imaginary boogie man making the world this way. It is because of the fact that we cannot control people, and free enterprise and freewill always brings some level of chaos. You can try for Utopia or La la land dreaming. Im a realist. The way it has always been is how it will always be. In perpetual cycles of good vs evil. The ying and yang, baby! Get some!!

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