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VitaminPb t1_isdv6mr wrote

This article has precisely zero information about the batteries.

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fatherdale t1_isey567 wrote

Not so much an article as a forwarded press release.

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RamslamOO7 OP t1_isff7tb wrote

>Not so much an article as a forwarded press release.

Yes

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PlankOfWoood t1_isdytxp wrote

GM: Why would we be so stupid to let other car manufacturers know how our technology works?

1

Moose_Hooves t1_isf95ey wrote

Ultium batteries?

Does that mean they found something other than Lithium that holds a charge?

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luaks1337 t1_isg803f wrote

No Ultium is not even an element. It's an arbitrary name made up by the marketing people. Technologically there is no significant breakthrough here. They added a very small amount of Aluminium to the default Nickel, Cobalt, Manganese battery composition and that's it. It's cheaper to produce and probably offers longer battery life but i'd say it doesn't stand out from competitors.

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Moose_Hooves t1_isggku8 wrote

Do they still use lithium? I have a lot of money invested in lithium stock and I’m worried something better will come along and mess up my portfolio.

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luaks1337 t1_isgs7bs wrote

Yes all of the car batteries currently use Lithium which is why it's typically not explicitly mentioned when listing battery compounds. You might want to look into Sodium-Ion batteries. With those batteries the Lithium-Ions will be replaced by Sodium-Ions. Right now its properties aren't good enough to replace Lithium in most use cases but we'll see them coming extremely popular in the next 3-5 years. That doesn't mean you should invest in Sodium tho. Sodium is 500 times more abundant in earths crust than Lithium (basically salt in the ocean = Sodium). It's so much and so cheap to extract that prices will likely stay cheap even with demand skyrocketing. My bet would be to either invest into battery companies itself or the suppliers of Sodium. Right now CATL (biggest battery company) is pioneering Sodium-Ion batteries but investing into them is dodgy because it's a Chinese stock. It's hard to say which company will take the lead especially since there is also some potential left in Lithium-Ion batteries which could delay Sodium-Ion batteries taking over the market. The more expensive Lithium gets the faster will companies push for a significantly cheaper Sodium alternative.

I'm also not sure how well the market has already adjusted prices for future breakthroughs. I don't think it's an over hyped technology but it's definitely not a secret tip either.

When looking for companies you might also want to think about the applications the different batteries have. Since Lithium is very energy dense it's mostly used in products that don't offer a lot of space for the amount of energy required (phones, laptops, performance cars). On the other hand as of now Sodium batteries are not as dense while being cheap which is why they make a perfect fit for home/mass electricity storage.

On a side note: you may also want to look into recycling companies. Today only very few batteries are recycled but that's only because electric cars/electricity storage wasn't a thing in 2010. However, 10 years from now battery recycling will grow exactly as fast as the electric car market is growing right now. It's just a delayed boom.

That was a longer comment than I anticipated... As a poor student I can't afford to invest which is why I have the urge to put my thoughts out there whenever I can haha

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Moose_Hooves t1_islt2a0 wrote

What are you studying? Everything you said made sense to me. How do you know so much about batteries?

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luaks1337 t1_isnq0ok wrote

I'm 2nd semester studying AI/CS and I don't have a deeper understanding of chemistry. My battery/economic knowledge mostly comes from university talks on youtube and further researching ^(*googling*) stuff I don't understand. Statistics and maths from my actual studies come in handy even though I'm pretty average at them. It's like a rabbit hole. You start with a simple video that gets you interested and after that you just google all the new keywords and read about them. Tesla > Tesla drivetrain > Tesla battery > Tesla 4680 battery cell > cylindrical battery cell > cylindrical vs. pouch cell > solid state battery > NIO solid state battery > Daimler eCitaro solid state battery > battery lifecycles > battery properties > battery composition > LFP battery > M3P battery > CATL company > Sodium-Ion battery ................

Learning about researchers and institutes also helps me to get a deeper understanding of the current scientific discussions going on etc. It's always important to not fall for researchers that just say stuff because they work for a certain company or similar.

The same thing is possible with every (new) technology. Renewable hydrogen, alternative energy storage solutions, solar panels, wind turbines, nuclear reactors (<- spicy topic), AI, programming languages, it-security, batteries, mechanics of a central bank...

Of course none of it will ever make up for an actual degree in one of these fields but that is not the point. It's just a fun thing to do.

Edit: i forget to mention that most battery stuff I know comes from the KIT/HLU channels on youtube but they are 100% in German.

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Ill-fated-muskrat t1_isdz9q0 wrote

Allow me to fill you in:

It's the same exact scam lithium ion tech that is in every other electric car currently on the market, but it's modular and scalable. This way, smaller GM vehicles will burn less intensely than the bigger ones when you park them in a garage.

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V02272020 t1_iserj2x wrote

Don’t you have some rally or book burning to be at?

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Ill-fated-muskrat t1_isgo4mh wrote

I love ev's, but lithium ion is an absolute scam that we are going to be dealing with the waste stream of for decades. The battery technology just isn't there yet.

Whatever you do, don't look up how those batteries are "recycled".

Edit: Shit, you don't even know enough about the EV market to get the joke in there. Edit 2: Ah yes, ignore the person when they have an informed opinion of a thing you have barely even surface level knowledge about. Never change, reddit.

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Franklin_le_Tanklin t1_ise3cx3 wrote

Wtf is ultium? It’s a li-ion battery pack like all the other EV’s yes?

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linde50 t1_isevz6s wrote

It’s just another marketing ploy.

“We have a design for a battery pack and motor”

Wow

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AmpEater t1_ise4yb3 wrote

You should Google “what is Google?”

0

FuturologyBot t1_isdub8x wrote

The following submission statement was provided by /u/RamslamOO7:

Do you think Ultium batteries can change the game of Electric Cars?

Modular propulsion and a highly adaptable third-generation global EV platform, both powered by exclusive Ultium batteries, are at the core of General Motors’ approach. They will enable the business to compete with almost any consumer on the market right now, whether they’re seeking work trucks, high-performance machinery, or luxury experiences.

Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/y4et29/new_ultium_batteries_and_a_flexible_global_ev/isdrqk1/

1

skgody t1_isdzagz wrote

A form factor that can replace existing drive train might be nice.

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OliverSparrow t1_issyv2c wrote

Prototype needs a bit of work before commercialisation. :)

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RamslamOO7 OP t1_isdrqk1 wrote

Do you think Ultium batteries can change the game of Electric Cars?

Modular propulsion and a highly adaptable third-generation global EV platform, both powered by exclusive Ultium batteries, are at the core of General Motors’ approach. They will enable the business to compete with almost any consumer on the market right now, whether they’re seeking work trucks, high-performance machinery, or luxury experiences.

−2

chesterbennediction t1_isdv17a wrote

How about for cheap compact and subcompact cars for around 20 to 25k? Doesn't matter how much better one EV is over the other if I can't afford it.

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Surur t1_isegdat wrote

The answer is China. They have EVs there from $5,000 to $150,000 and it's around 30% market share there.

Chinese EVs are about to invade Europe en masse.

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BreakRaven t1_isem1xz wrote

> China. They have EVs there from $5,000

And then they hit another country that doesn't disregard safety features and the price balloons by $20k.

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thoruen t1_isduhb7 wrote

what about affordable?

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kaminaowner2 t1_ishtjfa wrote

You can buy one for 26k and to be honest there aren’t many new vehicles worth a damn that’s cheaper than that, it’s not fair but it’s probably as good as one can expect from anything worth buying.

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NecroJoe t1_isdwq7q wrote

Sounds like their problem is that they are expecting to compete WITH customers, and not FOR customers.

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