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venomandvaccine t1_iubqgfn wrote

Well the EU needs to step it up a bit more then.

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notbatmanyet t1_iucone2 wrote

This does not include central bank assets, as it alone is about 300 billion.

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alluballu t1_iuchpqf wrote

I think that a lot of their assets are in Switzerland, which isn’t in the EU.

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tohender t1_iucja3r wrote

Switzerland has taken over all EU sanctions packages against Russia since the invasion of Ukraine on February 24.

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/small-rise-in-russian-assets-frozen-in-switzerland/47739794#:~:text=The%20Swiss%20authorities%20have%20so,assets%20belonging%20to%20sanctioned%20Russians.

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alluballu t1_iuckwsg wrote

I might be dumb but if I understood this correctly the amount they have frozen is separate from the EU, so in total they would have frozen 23.8 billion. I have a feeling the total could be higher, but then again I won’t even pretend to understand economics.

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green_flash t1_iucv4to wrote

These are only assets of Russian citizens, not government assets.

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YagaDillon t1_iuc5187 wrote

Hey, how much did the US freeze?

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lord_pizzabird t1_iuc74xj wrote

The most recent article I could find noted an addition $30billion, around $330billion in total.

This is part of a global effort, lead by the US that includes a taskforce to investigate and tag Russian assets worldwide.

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green_flash t1_iud1rq8 wrote

That's not an answer to the question how much the US itself is freezing.

You're also mixing up oligarch assets and central bank assets.

> The Department of Justice said Wednesday that the U.S. and its allies have frozen more than $30 billion of Russian oligarch assets and immobilized about $300 billion of Moscow’s central bank funds.

Source: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/29/doj-says-allies-have-frozen-30-billion-of-russian-oligarch-assets.html

The 13.8 billion euros of oligarch assets the EU had frozen in July are part of the 30 billion dollars mentioned in that article. The 300 billion dollars are unrelated, since those are central bank funds. I couldn't find any indication how much of those were frozen by the US and how much were frozen by the EU. Last figure I got is that in May the EU had frozen 23 billion euros in Russian central bank assets whereas the US had frozen 100 billion dollars in Russian central bank assets. Source

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Critical-Usual t1_iucnj2n wrote

Now that is a massive amount. Need to start selling them away to rebuild Ukraine

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lord_pizzabird t1_iudqbzu wrote

I’m sure China would be interested in buying chunks of the Russia Far East. Russia is increasingly going to become more willing to sell it too, as everyone regionally realizes they may not be able told the territory.

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tomorrow509 t1_iucvgzg wrote

The US has a whistleblower program that offers rewards for information leading to the seizure of Russian oligarch assets located in that country. The EU should do something similar. I'm sure the numbers would go up.

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MonarchistParty OP t1_iubn67h wrote

The figure has risen from the roughly 13.8 billion euros ($13.75 billion) “from oligarchs and other entities” that the EU had frozen, mainly in five countries, said EU Justice Commissioner Didier Reynders on Saturday.

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LowBadger3622 t1_iubr5ar wrote

“Those are rookie numbers!”

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--Gungnir-- t1_iubwhr3 wrote

I would like to be a "rookie" with those numbers in my bank account..!!
Where do I sign up?

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LowBadger3622 t1_iuc0b05 wrote

Go ask poostain, I hear he’s hiring for many positions

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eskieski t1_iucjhrx wrote

poostain 🤣🤣🤣almost collapsed a lung, laughing so hard.

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[deleted] t1_iuc0qvn wrote

[removed]

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LowBadger3622 t1_iuc12nz wrote

17 bill is not exactly a lot when it comes to multinational/G7 buying power, is my point.

So, say the US has Bill Gates, elon musk, and Jeff Bezos money, saying we seized 17 bill is the equivalent of kanye cancelled. No big deal in the grand scheme of things. Thanks for dragging this out.

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--Gungnir-- t1_iuc1xzd wrote

It's a lot to be in MY bank account.

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LowBadger3622 t1_iuc2cr2 wrote

Yeah… I got it, but you haven’t, apparently. Those are rookie numbers for seizing a significant portion of a major geopolitical players buying power because it’s not much money to them.

You keep saying but your bank account. It’s the equivalent of $1,700 in your bank account; do you have $1,700?

−1

--Gungnir-- t1_iuc2nl3 wrote

17 Billion in my bank account is what I was talking about.
No "equivalent" wanted.

And yeah I "Got it" from the start, you sound mad now... That's weird.

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IllegalTree t1_iucvnph wrote

17 billion here, 17 billion there... pretty soon it begins to add up to real money.

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OldMork t1_iubu0dv wrote

Send Putin one symbolic euro to close the account and the rest to rebuild ukraine.

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autotldr t1_iubp3m4 wrote

This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 69%. (I'm a bot)

> BRUSSELS: The European Union has frozen Russian assets worth around 17 billion euros since Moscow invaded Ukraine, EU Justice Commissioner Didier Reynders said in an interview published Saturday.

> The total of frozen assets was 14.5 billion euros by mid-September, when the Commissioner criticised the lack of efforts from several member states, including Hungary.

> "So far, the assets of 90 people have been frozen, more than 17 billion euros in seven member states, including 2.2 billion euros in Germany," he told German media group Funke, including the Westdeutsche Allgemeine Zeitung daily.

Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: billion^#1 euros^#2 frozen^#3 asset^#4 including^#5

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Gyftycf t1_iuckm5e wrote

Good. Ban them from SWIFT too. Steam (game company) has banned Russian payments. People on Russia online newspapers (RIA, translated, I don't speak Russian) are pissed.

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Dropped-pie t1_iucuo0c wrote

Pretty sure that was in the first round of sanctions

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Gyftycf t1_iucyu47 wrote

No, Russians who have fled to Turkey and other countries can still access their RU banks. I'm not a SWIFT expert, but I've read Russians saying they still can.

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jknl t1_iufl98g wrote

They can not use Money from there Russia bank accounts.(if outside Russia) But they can access and withdrawal money from there non Russia banks Russia.(if outside Russia).

Russian banks are sanctioned not the Russian people. Only the few Elite that are personally sanctioned, suppose to have there personal bank accounts frozen with western banks.

The regular Russian Citizens can access there personal bank accounts with western banks. But there can be no transfer of money with Russian banks and western banks, because if the sanctions/ban on Russian banks

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epiquinnz t1_iucs3ot wrote

I hope some of those assets can be liquidated for the Finnish border fence, so we can say: "we made the Russians pay for it!"

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Amstourist t1_iuczlhw wrote

Wtf is with this "freezing" bullshit?

Seize it! Create a fund, use 30% to help current refugees with EU supervisioned distribution and the rest keep in a fund already assigned for EU supervisioned rebuild of Ukraine.

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Euphoric_Air5109 t1_iud1xq1 wrote

As long as the oligarchs have a theoretical possibility to get these assets back, they might try to convince Russia to stop their madness. It is better to keep these assets frozen to give them the incentive to work towards good.

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notalaborlawyer t1_iudbyoi wrote

>oligarchs . . . give them an incentive to work towards good.

Oh, you sweet naive summer child.

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Ajk337 t1_iudaa8p wrote

It'd be interesting if there were a policy where that every day Russia was creating casualties, a small portion of seized funds would be donated to Ukraine

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RealDeal83 t1_iuelud5 wrote

It's been 8 months, I dont think that's happening.

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Euphoric_Air5109 t1_iuemlo0 wrote

Until summer things looked pretty good for Russians. Oligarchs will be loosing hope during the winter. They will start to use their money to make sure they get more money.

There are plenty of opportunities in Russia when you have dollars. Some of these opportunities will be detrimental for war or even putin.

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SiarX t1_iudro2k wrote

Oligarches have no political weight in Putin Russia. This is not 1990s.

−2

No_Pen_4702 t1_iucki5q wrote

Transfer it to the Ukrainian treasury as a partial war reparations payment.

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AbandonedLogic t1_iuf44u6 wrote

Can we redistribute that money to the EU citizens so that they can pay their energy bills maybe? Or perhaps build some massive renewable energy projects? Or subsidise solar installations for all?

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LolcatP t1_iucym2y wrote

defrost it then! that's a waste of money

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aeppelcyning t1_iucznsh wrote

Good, now time to seize them permanently and give them to Ukraine.

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Textification t1_iuduufm wrote

Just start turning the money over to Ukraine and nations supplying aid and shelter to displaced Ukrainians.

That will get Russia howling for sure. Knowing that their money is financing Ukraine's defense and rebuilding.

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_bono983 t1_iuffvwy wrote

Give those billions to Ukraine.

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joper90 t1_iucjtxo wrote

Who takes the interest off that cash?

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RawbeardX t1_iucu4dz wrote

ok. now seize them instead. take all of their shit.

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Teamnoq t1_iudaxfp wrote

They better do something soon, with global warming, it won’t stay frozen much longer!

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Formulka t1_iudkqkj wrote

That will buy a lot of Leopards.

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Romans-go-home t1_iudxacd wrote

At the rate russia is going, they are going to have to sell Siberia to the US to pay for this major-league fuck-up.

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Tobias---Funke t1_iudxgtf wrote

That only covers about 3 months of rebuilding!

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waisonline99 t1_iufu35e wrote

Frozen?

Just take it as part payment for the destruction of Ukraine.

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innovationcynic t1_iucsw1h wrote

Let me know when it is confiscated. Until then it’s just parlor tricks.

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StealthPieThief t1_iudsbl0 wrote

Am I the only one that thinks 13 billion is a small number in this case?

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yokemhard t1_iuev3c8 wrote

Very small, one round of usa support was 40 billion. That's one round, of usa alone (albeit usa share of help is approx 80% of the west's support)

I don't think the rebuild will happen without reparations as part of the negotiations, should there be any.

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GorgeousGamer99 t1_iuc2uzt wrote

So that's like 2 superyachts?

−8

Waancho t1_iucew19 wrote

"The world’s largest private vessel, Khalifa bin Zayed Al Nahyan’s Azzam, reaches an astounding 180 meters (590 feet) and cost $600 million to build." according to Forbes.

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Spyt1me t1_iucyvsv wrote

EU previously frozen like 300 billion, so this is just some leftover bits.

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stanfordgay t1_iucxzbz wrote

17 Billion is nothing. Not worth a headline.

−10

Level-Blueberry-2707 t1_iubv1sn wrote

Most of the money should be redistributed to the Russian people after the war rather then some mafia states slush fund.

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lord_pizzabird t1_iuc7rx9 wrote

Strong disagree. Most of the money should go to the victims in Ukraine, not the people who enabled and knowingly looked the other way.

If anything, the Russian people should owe Ukrainians reparations till the country is rebuilt and every last Ukrainian veteran is alive.

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-LostInCloud- t1_iucqfqf wrote

Look at what happened after WW1, and what happened after WW2 in West and East Germany respectively.

Russia needs to change, not be fucked over.

I'm all for giving the seized assets to Ukraine, but if we ever reach a point where we could push war reparations onto Russia, maybe we should not destabilise it by starting with massive debt.

Slava Ukraine

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lord_pizzabird t1_iudpvl9 wrote

Germany was in massive debt after ww2, same with Japan. The difference was a semi-permanent occupation by allied forces. In both cases US forces are still there, in the form of military bases.

The lesson of ww2, learned from ww1 is that a country can’t just be left to their own devices post world war, but needs a long term nation building investment and occupation to enforce it.

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-LostInCloud- t1_iuduwkj wrote

I think it's more the sentiment: do you want 'revenge' and punishment, or do you want to assist the country to develop into an ally?

East Germany also was occupied, but fundamentally different than West Germany.

If we ever get to a point like that with Russia, we need to not punish them, but help them.

Oh and punish a the fucks that helped perpetuate the war and warcrimes.

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lord_pizzabird t1_iudx4bt wrote

Revenge would be not doing enough, allowing war to pop off again in few decades.

Also, there's a huge difference between going too far and adequately punishing those responsible. It has to be an even response with a nation building plan, or you get Germany after WW1.

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mikepictor t1_iucpf4d wrote

A lot of Russian people are outright protesting the war. Don’t put this on them.

−5

Est_De_Chadistan t1_iud7s5d wrote

Can you be more specific what does a lot of russians mean? The way how it looked like those who protested are still less than number of mobilised people. Yes, few hundred thousands is a lot. But out of 140millions? It is still a minority.

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BlueMatWheel123 t1_iuefbww wrote

Unless there are protests that number in the hundreds of thousands to millions of people all over the country, the Russians citizens are not doing enough.

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Spyt1me t1_iucym2h wrote

Nope.

But i do agree if Russia sees a regime change we should be helping them rebuild as well as Ukraine.

We need to show the Russian people that the western countries arent as bad as their fascist dictator told them. This way they will be more amicable to western ideas which makes any wannabe dictator's job more difficult.

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BlueMatWheel123 t1_iuef5pa wrote

Nah. The Russian people are complicit in this war. You can't look the other way and claim innocence in this case.

All the assets seized should go to rebuild Ukraine.

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LetUsSpeakFreely t1_iubyb23 wrote

Yeah, that'll calm things down and not back Russia into a corner forcing them to make hasty, extreme, possibly apocalyptic actions.

−53

APsWhoopinRoom t1_iuc2byt wrote

Relax, they wouldn't do that unless their sovereignty is threatened.

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LetUsSpeakFreely t1_iuc4g4o wrote

I'm not fan of Putin, but from their perspective their sovereignty is being threatened. NATO has been adding member countries all along Russia's borders and through that, tons of military support. Their access to warm water ports is virtually nil and will be nil if they lose access to Ukraine.

I think Putin is going about this the wrong way. For the last 30 years Russia should have been creating industry and cultivating trade partners, but their leadership is stuck in a Cold War frame of mind.

If things keep going like this, we're going to see Russia become a vassal state to China, and they'll try to undermine the dollar and euro through BRICs.

The media would have you believe this is all Putin being an unreasonable madman, but there is a MUCH larger game here that's being ignored.

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APsWhoopinRoom t1_iuc4wtq wrote

If they actually believed their sovereignty was in peril, they would have launched the nukes. Keep in mind, what they say is very different than what they actually believe/feel. It's all posturing. They wouldn't launch nukes unless troops are actually marching towards major Russian cities (not in annexed territory).

Putin loves power, and he won't have anyone to oppress if everyone is dead. Nukes won't fly unless as an absolute last resort to keep his country from being overrun.

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[deleted] t1_iubpml6 wrote

[removed]

−60

APsWhoopinRoom t1_iuc28ra wrote

Do you have any idea how much a trillion is? They haven't spent anywhere even remotely close to that number on this war

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peter-doubt t1_iuclaoj wrote

Have you ignored the citizens who have poured in their own resources for the safety of millions, for over half a year?

That's not free.

−22

APsWhoopinRoom t1_iudpcnq wrote

No? That still doesn't bring the total even remotely close to a trillion. Again, I think you have no concept of just how large that number is

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ShroomFoot t1_iubw57o wrote

I don't know where you got your numbers from, but the EU has pledged around 18,000,000,000 euros and the US has sent over 13,500,000,000 USD. Even rounded up to the nearest ten billion and doubled and added together it is still quite short of even 1,000,000,000,000 in either currency.

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