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LunchMasterFlex t1_j8w9uy0 wrote

Everybody wants their fancy ramen, but don’t nobody care about the people who schlepped it uptown. I hate this elitist bullshit.

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nonlawyer t1_j8x17t9 wrote

My hot take: just ban the delivery apps. Things were fine when you had to pick up the phone and call a place that’s actually in your neighborhood.

Since that’s never gonna happen, at least ban the gross gamification algorithms that force the delivery guys to ride like daredevils or risk being demoted and kicked from being able to work.

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whateverisok t1_j8xl694 wrote

Due to COVID, a lot of local mom & pop places closed, so now you're going out further and further to get what you want - it could be 40-50 min time I take off from work just to get whatever I ordered from a local spot back to my apartment.

I still go in-person to the local spots and not the chains, and order there - I need to walk my dog anyway, so it's more convenient.

But I know a lot of people who won't do that even if the place is only a 5 min walk away, because it also ends up taking like 30 min by the time you get ready to go out, go up & down the elevator, and get there

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Shreddersaurusrex OP t1_j91fdd4 wrote

Yeah so Doordash and Grubhub are the worst with pickup/deliver by times. DD gives violations for not completing pickups or deliveries by a certain time. If you get enough it can lead to deactivation.

I think that the apps are great but that they need to pay the workers fairly. Ppl need to tip fairly vs just turning a blind eye to the exploitative nature of the system. There’s a cycle of apps making work hard->workers being frustrated->customers not being satisfied.

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bklyn1977 t1_j8wg6dq wrote

Maybe the delivery apps should be subsidizing this.

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Shreddersaurusrex OP t1_j8wpmqw wrote

Lol they classify the workers as independent contractors to avoid diff laws & regulations.

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olli_bombastico t1_j8wkfcy wrote

You mean the customers.

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creativepositioning t1_j8x94d3 wrote

The customers already do... if you order on seamless or door dash, it's something like 10-15% fee on top of a delivery fee, on top of the tip.

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olli_bombastico t1_j8xbfp8 wrote

That's the point. Why would companies subsidize it while they can just push the cost to he customers.

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creativepositioning t1_j8xc7yn wrote

Yet the customers already pay and the riders get no support...

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olli_bombastico t1_j8y5fbb wrote

They should ask their bosses for bathrooms. Oh wait, they are their own bosses.

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creativepositioning t1_j8yc25q wrote

Yeah, we shouldn't allow Seamless and Door Dash to treat their workers and categorize them this way...

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Bobbyscousin t1_j8wr0sc wrote

That's the way it always is in NYC ... an Boston ... and LA ... and Seattle ...

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Die-Nacht t1_j8wsc0c wrote

The worst is whenever there's a new bike lane being proposed and ppl say "how many ppl even bike? Deliver workers don't count".

I've heard that many times. Ofc when asked "why don't they count?" they get very quiet.

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gnukidsontheblock t1_j8wvktr wrote

Probably because what they ride are more akin to motorcycles rather than bikes, and theyre the most egregious when going the wrong way down those lanes and running reds. I dont order delivery because I dont want to compound on those problems, but I also get there isnt a perfect “lane” for them to use, sidewalk is obv bad but riding in traffic isnt ideal.

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NYCCrone t1_j8wghu8 wrote

I no longer order delivery because I don’t want to support a system that encourages horribly reckless behavior from delivery drivers - driving on the sidewalks and going the wrong way on streets in ebikes and motorbikes is dangerous and I don’t want a busy subway station in an already complicated intersection to be made even more dangerous by this behavior. No plans were provided as to how many drivers this hub would accommodate nor did representatives of the delivery drivers address pedestrian safety concerns. Finally, no representatives of Grubhub, Uber Eats, Doordash, etc. spoke at the community board hearing - why are taxpayers expected to pay for a hub benefiting these businesses? Why aren’t they paying for it?

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drpvn t1_j8wl90q wrote

It’s quite easy to just walk down to a local restaurant and pick the food up.

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CorporalDingleberry t1_j8xmlsk wrote

My thing is that what if I want delivery from some place in my neighborhood, but it's more than a few blocks away? (i.e. if I live in the West 60s but there's a place I want food from in the West 80s). 20 blocks each way is a bit far to pick-up food since it may not even be hot when you get it back. Whereas 20 blocks straight down a bike should be pretty quick and easy.

Agreed though that this doesn't mean delivery workers should ride bikes like maniacs. I hate how they go through red lights and go the wrong way.

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Shreddersaurusrex OP t1_j91emno wrote

That’s ~ 1.25 miles. Should be worth the driver’s while for such a distance.

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D14DFF0B t1_j8xtkr5 wrote

Do you think delivery bikers were perfect, law-abiding angels before seamless came along?

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Shreddersaurusrex OP t1_j8wptg0 wrote

The workers are contractors not employees.

Why do you assume that their behavior will be dangerous?

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NYCCrone t1_j8wqxpc wrote

Repeated observations of delivery drivers driving without regard to pedestrian safety and complete silence on what steps will be taken to ensure pedestrian safety, which is what the bulk of complaints to the CB around this proposed hub focused on. Look - I know the delivery drivers don’t drive like this because they’re horrible people. It’s a crappy system that incentivizes this dangerous behavior, which is why I don’t order delivery. But these safety concerns need to be considered and addressed.

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fapplesauc3 t1_j8x4h40 wrote

It’s a non issue. The primary killer of pedestrians in this city are cars, which take up an inordinate amount of space, not the ebike delivery workers. I see some of them occasionally slowly ride in parts of the sidewalk, but the vast majority of them ride in the road because they can go faster in the road. It’s sad to see people take out their frustrations on these poor immigrants than on the actual problem and pedestrian killers in this city.

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Pennwisedom t1_j8wtge2 wrote

>Why do you assume that their behavior will be dangerous?

Yes, why would one assume that thing that constantly happens would continue to happen? A better question is what do you assume it would be different?

But I agree with the guy above, I simply don't order delivery anymore.

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[deleted] t1_j8wucob wrote

Go outside for 5 minutes and stand on a corner, you can't be serious.

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spicytoastaficionado t1_j8wxofe wrote

Because delivery workers have a long history of being reckless?

To be clear, I understand this is just a symptom of an incredibly predatory system they are working for, but we have to be honest and acknowledge that delivery people engaging in dangerous behavior is systemic and not just anecdotal.

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bklyn1977 t1_j8vo6wr wrote

Before everyone goes apeshit, Community Board resolutions are only advisories. City agencies can accept or reject them.

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mowotlarx t1_j8wt336 wrote

Yup! Community Board members aren't elected. They're handpicked by local electeds and then voted on by people who are already on the board. They are in no way representative of an entire opinion of any neighborhood, in fact they are usually outliers in terms of homeownership, car ownership, age and other demographics.

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k1lk1 t1_j8wf7ls wrote

Stop ordering delivery all the time, it's lazy, exploitative and incentivizes bad behavior like riding on the sidewalk. Get off your god damn ass and cook a meal.

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lll_lll_lll t1_j8x3do7 wrote

What industry isn’t exploitative? Do you realize the iPhone you posted this from supports slavery-level cobalt mining in the Congo? Do you know where your clothes are made? Come off it.

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Monkeyavelli t1_j8xrmyh wrote

Thanks, Mr. Gotcha!

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lll_lll_lll t1_j95y71g wrote

Getting self-righteous about walking to the deli for a bacon egg sandwich is not exactly saving the world here.

Meanwhile let’s just ignore any exploitation involved in things that we like, and if anyone points that out we’ll just call it a “gotcha.”

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Mammoth_Sprinkles705 t1_j9hdn2y wrote

So we need to demolish capitalism then it sounds like it's and exploitative and unethical system

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lll_lll_lll t1_j9kpnbf wrote

You can’t demolish capitalism. Technology has made us a global society, any capitalist country can just subsume any other country trying to opt out. You would need simultaneous agreement of all nations which is never going to happen. The Congo will continue to be exploited by someone, the only change would be who else steps in to do the exploiting if one country stopped.

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k1lk1 t1_j8xmvjg wrote

Imagine using reddit from a phone

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nychuman t1_j8xvgw3 wrote

I very rarely order delivery anymore because this whole web of bullshit is cancer on the city.

You live in NYC, get your ass up and walk a block to get your bacon egg and cheese.

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Sere_C t1_j8y4cni wrote

I know there's a trend for classic nostalgia going on, but nobody is actually serious about going back to Blockbuster, buying CDs from Sam Goody, or playing video games on a CRT television. However, if there was one thing I wish would revert back to the past, it's food delivery. I have no issue calling a restaurant or ordering through their website where an actual employee of the restaurant delivers my meal using their car. Delivery apps have caused more harm (all the reasons already explained in this thread) than good imo.

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Shreddersaurusrex OP t1_j8yp3k2 wrote

They allowed restaurants to reduce labor costs. They also allowed customers to more easily order without hassles like delivery zones and having to deal w/busy signals.

I think customers always need to tip fairly. The apps could implement a service charge that actually goes to the driver instead of the optional tip. Restaurants should have delivery zones. If not then the customer needs to tip well enough to make it worth the driver’s while.

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leibinz110 t1_j97wqgi wrote

I'm with you! Frankly I also wish we went back to yellow cabs flooding the streets. Uber prices have gotten ridiculous and I miss they days where you could just walk to the corner and hail a cab.

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_Maxolotl t1_j8weid2 wrote

Chief of a NIMBY organization has NIMBY opinions, as expected.

I wish the deliveristas had a shared blacklist. Sean Khorsandi should be on it.

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drpvn t1_j8wgo4f wrote

It does seem like an odd spot for this. Seems like it would get really crammed and chaotic with all the subway traffic.

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Unfair t1_j8x2adx wrote

I feel so bad for delivery workers - so many people rely on them but it seems like everyone wants to make their lives as difficult as possible.

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SolitaryMarmot t1_j8x1x80 wrote

I looked for instances of delivery guys killing pedestrians or drivers and didn't see any in a brief news search.
NYC has 2020 stats up for cyclist on pedestrian injuries and fatalites. There were 320 pedestrian injuries and 55 cyclist injuries. There were no pedestrian fatalities and 1 cyclist fatality. In context there were 6495 pedestrian injuries by cars and 95 fatalites. There were 5175 cyclist injuries by cars and 24 cyclist fatalities.

Being against bike parking as a safety measure while not simultaneously not demanding the streets be shut down to car parking seems either disineguious or irrational to me.

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creativepositioning t1_j8xaf9i wrote

Do you think most crashes or incidents by delivery guys get reported? I'd think any delivery person on delivery person incident would not be reported.

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mowotlarx t1_j8xuebo wrote

Of course they are reported. Every vehicular injury and death is reported because they end up in police reports. If delivery guys were killing people we'd have known by now. Be serious.

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creativepositioning t1_j8xv3nj wrote

>Of course they are reported. Every vehicular injury and death is reported because they end up in police reports. If delivery guys were killing people we'd have known by now. Be serious.

No they don't. I was literally hit by a car and the cops came and didn't do anything and kept it out of the statistics. You are naive.

>If delivery guys were killing people we'd have known by now

What the fuck are you talking about? No one is saying delivery guys are killing people. I'm saying they get into crashes all the time and none of its reported, to the cops, to insurance...

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mowotlarx t1_j8xwkdf wrote

Right so there's a deep state conspiracy where zero delivery bike accidents are reported to the police, is that right? A secret epidemic you can only back up with vibes?

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creativepositioning t1_j8xxvvt wrote

You are on some insane strawman about people getting killed, as opposed to the tons of crashes that happen and go unreported all the time, which is what I'm talking about.

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SolitaryMarmot t1_j8xc5lg wrote

I've never seen any evidence that these types of accidents are under reported. And I can't imagine why they would be underreported if someone has damages that are more than an insurance deductible. If there are accidents unreported they are probably like the minor ones where cars strike pedestrians but there are no damages.

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creativepositioning t1_j8xlfyz wrote

Why? Because the riders have questionable citizenship statuses, don't want to deal with the liability, aren't going to wait around for cops, etc, etc. Honestly, hard to take you seriously if you are actually arguing this.

>And I can't imagine why they would be underreported if someone has damages that are more than an insurance deductible.

The guy delivering your chinese food isn't make a claim on insurance for any damages because a) they aren't waiting for a police report, b) they don't have insurance that covers them biking. Honestly - what the fuck are you talking about?

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SolitaryMarmot t1_j8xn7zh wrote

What the hell does immigration status have to do with an insurance claim? Wut? Lol

The cops aren't going to ask for a valid visa for any type of accident. You don't have to have a valid visa to get a drivers license even for a car in NYC.

But the cops aren't even going to come for a bike accident unless someone is very hurt or there's more than $500 worth of damage. They wont even come for a car accident with minor damage. The only time your immigration status may matter is if you are charged with a crime after an crash which happens very rarely. Is it possible there has been a case where an undocumented delivery guy was working shit faced drunk and ran over another delivery guy and killed them? I guess it's possible but it's never happened. At least not to my knowledge.

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DisasterFartiste t1_j8xmb4a wrote

As someone who has been hit by a bike and a car while walking….much rather get hit by a bike lol

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mowotlarx t1_j8xu20x wrote

The delivery workers in congregate in my neighborhood are all unassuming and polite when they wait around for deliveries. Yes, I don't love when they sometimes drive up on the sidewalks, but I've been nearly hit far more often by cars than them. I really don't see why NIMBYs have an issue with this. Delivery workers aren't a group I'd consider "undesirable" in my neighborhood. They're just doing their jobs... incidentally for the people in that neighborhood.

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Commercial_Dish_3763 t1_j8y8w4r wrote

These delivery workers work so hard, in such a physically demanding, dangerous environment and people don't want to interfere with them having a vital rest place? Like do people ordering delivery not realize what they put their delivery drivers through? People can be so callous.

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Shreddersaurusrex OP t1_j8yo378 wrote

They want them out of sight & out of mind. The city went from “We’re all in this together” to “No you can’t rest in my neighborhood park.”

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KidAstoria t1_j8wp92z wrote

It’s the Trump lovers who hate this idea.

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IamChantus t1_j8wyxa0 wrote

Seems like it has pretty broad opposition for different reasons. From the city paying for a hub that companies whose grunts are independent contractors will profit from, to pedestrian safety.

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